I was reading my new Playboy and saw this in the Forum:
Today on the web, television and radio, you can watch, listen to and read what you want when you want. You can seek out and discuss the news that pleases you, dismissing the rest. And you can indulge your political, social or scientific theories, however baseless, with people who exactly the same way. As a result, on many of our most contentious national issues — the Iraq war and global warming, for instance — society has splintered. We no longer merely hold opinions different from one another; we also hold different facts
I read this and thought how true, and how this theory hits home on Fluid Imagination.
Just read some of the posts and comments between Kyle and Justin, since those two are the only ones who actually reference anything and who don’t, like myself, just blurt out an opinion.
I was just wondering what your thoughts might be on this.
[Editor's note: Adam, Big Dave (not little Dave) -- I know you guys have talked about this, so I'm expecting to read something insightful from you on this one.]
9 Comments
it depends on the issue at hand… - some issues are complicated and almost impossible to be broken down by a fact or two… - there can be thousands of facts about one issue like the iraq war… - and just like an opinion… - the fact referencer can pick and choose which facts to include… - and also… - like an opinion… - facts can change or evolve… - facts can also be a pack of lies or a distortion of the truth… - and all of the facts that anyone mentions are literally synonymous with their opinion or highlight the reason that their opinion is the way it is…
everyone can find just as many facts to back up all of their opinions… - you can also fact check a fact that you don’t think is a fact if you really wanted to and counter it with your own if you think that the person that you’re debating with has his/her facts mixed up… - but even that is difficult… - just look at how g.w.b. has coasted along without being called or truly confronted on his glorious facts…
i don’t think that this is anything new… - you know… - people citing different facts to solidify their opinions… - especially in the political arena… - we just see more of it because of our technology…
and then there is common sense… - for example… - martin luther king jr.’s “i have a dream” speech… - you can’t very well fact check the validity of those words… - i guess you could… - but… - you’d have to be a pretty big dick to do so…
oh… - and shawn… - are you one of those: “i get playboy for the interviews” type of guy?
no, I am one of those guys that looks at the pictures first, then reads the articles…I am a red blooded male you know…with that being said, I think Playboy is one of the best magazines on the market for articles…and my wife agrees…
yeah… - you don’t survive in the magazine business as long as playboy has if it was a crappy magazine… - not only survive… - but… - thrive… - you know… - obviously hugh has done well for himself…
I just had a long conversaton with a family member who strongly supports McCain, mainly on the belief that Obama’s going to raise taxes on the poor, while McCain will lower them.
It seems like she’s been-for lack of a better word-suckered by the “baseless data” that Shawn references, and she’s not alone.
This NYT editorial says “If you doubt that the big lies are sticking, look at the latest Washington Post/ABC News poll. Half of voters now believe in the daily McCain refrain that Obama will raise their taxes. In fact, Obama proposes raising taxes only on the 1.9 percent of households that make more than $250,000 a year and cutting them for nearly everyone else.” http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/21/opinion/21rich.html?em
So, a slightly off-topic question I have is…does anyone else out there think Obama’s going to raise taxes on everyone? And if so, then why do you think that?
dovev… - what happened at the end of this conversation that you had with your family member? - did you convince her that she was being mislead on the tax issue? - is she still going to vote for mccain?
So, after my wife and I turned on the computer and quoted directly from Obama/McCain’s tax proposals, she said she understood their positions clearer…but still thinks Obama’s going to raise taxes on the poor, while McCain’s going to lower them!
I asked her why, in the face of this DATA, she thinks this, and she said she just has a gut feeling about it. This leads me to conclude that her “gut feeling” could come from any of the following beliefs:
1. McCain was a P.O.W., and therefore he is trustworthy.
2. Obama is Black, and therefore he is not trustworthy.
3. Republicans want to put money in your pocket.
As much as this conversation made me cringe, it was really interesting and important to get a sense of how a huge portion of the country perceives these issues. For example, I don’t think she’s prejudiced against Blacks, but I wonder how much subconscious thinking a lot of voters have regarding race.
I am not saying that Obama will raise taxes more then McCain but it is a little more complicated then just saying he will raise it for 250,000+ crowd.